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  1. #781
    QLD Administrator AdReNaLiN's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wittles View Post
    More info on this brake fitment...

    I see a easier option for my own brake upgrade coming... I found a set of NSX brakes...

    Brembo's look much better though...

    The brake caliper is a DC5R Brembo.
    The brake rotor is a S2000 AP1.

    It still requires a 5mm spacer behind the brake rotor to make it align properly.
    It increases the brake rotor size to 300mm.

    The NSX from memory works with the stock prelude rotor - so you get benefits of the lighter 2 pot caliper but its still the stock size rotor.

    Quote Originally Posted by gumus89 View Post
    Brake feel shmeel!
    An expensive way to be able to lock up the tyres like the stock calipers
    Sure, if you've got a stock engine... and stock tyres and stock wheels.

    It is required in QLD to get a brake upgrade of some kind when you are upgrading the horsepower of the engine. This is in the mod plate rules.

    Quote Originally Posted by PJF_Lude View Post
    try locking up brakes with semi-slicks or slicks with stock brakes. i can't do it, can you? Brake upgrade is very necessary in my opinion when upgrading power to the point you need semi-slicks on the street.
    I've seen this in person - the stock brakes just didnt cut it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Baz View Post
    probably a bit of a dumb question, but when do you reckon we'll be seeing this awesome car on the streets? what's left to do?

    i really love the progress on your car, it looks great
    You probably wont ever see it on the street because you're not in QLD

    Seriously though - the goal is to have it on the road before the end of this year.

    I have to do some more work with the heater hoses and the intercooler piping. I also have to run the wiring to the headlights / stuff up the front of the enginebay.

    I then have to fill all the fluids up and start the motor for the first time.

    Once I can verify everything's running nicely I will put the interior back in. I have a freshly cleaned carpet (thanks Ian) and the recaro seats etc to go back in

    Lots of fun!

  2. #782
    Silver Member ludecrs's Avatar
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    Better get a move on then!

    If you're coming tonight I might let you take my car for a run.....

    Get you back in that positive, can do attitude again like last time. lol.


    Prelude: Sold.
    S2000: Sold.
    NSX: Sold.
    F355: Coming...

  3. #783
    Gold Member gumus89's Avatar
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    5th Gen
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    VTiR
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    Quote Originally Posted by PJF_Lude View Post
    try locking up brakes with semi-slicks or slicks with stock brakes. i can't do it, can you? Brake upgrade is very necessary in my opinion when upgrading power to the point you need semi-slicks on the street.
    What are the rotor sizes on the 3rd gen compared to the 4th/5th?

    I completely understand that if you have super sticky tyres then you may not be able to lock them up. I do know that its not the increase in power that needs it, and seeing as on the street you will never be exceeding the speed limit, it isnt actually necessary. Especially as if you do in fact have semi's then you will be stopping much quicker than the commodore in the other lane anyway, whether you lock them up or not.

    BUT, they are a great addition considering you will probably be tracking it anyway. And they look sick.
    <a href=http://www.preludeaustralia.com/forum/showthread.php?t=42730 target=_blank>http://www.preludeaustralia.com/foru...ad.php?t=42730</a>
    Back to it's former glory... Almost.

  4. #784
    PA Janitor Bob's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gumus89 View Post
    What are the rotor sizes on the 3rd gen compared to the 4th/5th?

    I do know that its not the increase in power that needs it
    3rd gen rotors are 262mm
    4th & 5th gen Si / S models are 260mm
    4th & 5th gen Vtir are 282mm

    And as Steve said. A power upgrade like a turbo is LEGALLY required to have a brake upgrade.

  5. #785
    Gold Member gumus89's Avatar
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    Just a question, what constitutes a brake upgrade legally. Both calipers and rotors or just calipers?
    <a href=http://www.preludeaustralia.com/forum/showthread.php?t=42730 target=_blank>http://www.preludeaustralia.com/foru...ad.php?t=42730</a>
    Back to it's former glory... Almost.

  6. #786
    Silver Member PJF_Lude's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gumus89 View Post
    (edit)... Especially as if you do in fact have semi's then you will be stopping much quicker than the commodore in the other lane anyway, whether you lock them up or not.
    ...
    yes i daily drive on semi's
    and you original point was, standard brakes can lock wheels

    At a speed less than 60kph, i was unable to lock my brakes. Pedal was pushed all the way to the floor. There was so much pressure in the braking system that i blew a seal in my proportioning valve. Regardless of whether i could stop quicker than a commodore, i was unable to brake to the limit of my daily driven tires.

    So therefore
    Quote Originally Posted by gumus89 View Post
    Brake feel shmeel!
    An expensive way to be able to lock up the tyres like the stock calipers
    is an invalid arguement

    Sorry to clutter your thread with this crap Steve
    ~Ian~

    Anything thing I say is my opinion, all care, but no responsibility taken.

    1989 Prelude Si Turbo - Laguna gold - Progress thread index or My Garage
    Prelude Australia POTM - June 2009 ..... Prelude Power POTM - July 2010
    2006 CBR1000RR - Silver Metallic - Clicky

  7. #787
    Silver Member ludecrs's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PJF_Lude View Post
    Sorry to clutter your thread with this crap Steve
    Its okay, he's a mod, he can simply delete it!


    Prelude: Sold.
    S2000: Sold.
    NSX: Sold.
    F355: Coming...

  8. #788
    QLD Administrator AdReNaLiN's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ludecrs View Post
    If you're coming tonight I might let you take my car for a run.....
    Get you back in that positive, can do attitude again like last time. lol.
    Shit! You cant go back on that statement now.

    Quote Originally Posted by gumus89 View Post
    BUT, they are a great addition considering you will probably be tracking it anyway. And they look sick.
    I didnt do it just for the looks.... ok maybe just a little bit

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob View Post
    3rd gen rotors are 262mm
    4th & 5th gen Si / S models are 260mm
    4th & 5th gen Vtir are 282mm

    And as Steve said. A power upgrade like a turbo is LEGALLY required to have a brake upgrade.
    This is correct. The brembo upgrade is 300mm so that gives me a 18mm increase in rotor size over the VTIR upgrade I had previously.

    Brembos are 2 pot caliper so there's a bigger pad surface and more even pressure on the pad for more of an increase as well.

    Quote Originally Posted by gumus89 View Post
    Just a question, what constitutes a brake upgrade legally. Both calipers and rotors or just calipers?
    I believe you can get away with just a bigger caliper upgrade - Brad (ludecrs) managed to get his legal with the Spoon caliper upgrade alone - it stays with the same 300mm rotor.

  9. #789
    QLD Administrator AdReNaLiN's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ludecrs View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by PJF_Lude View Post
    Sorry to clutter your thread with this crap Steve
    Its okay, he's a mod, he can simply delete it!
    I wont delete it - its healthy discussion! I'm sure others will have similar questions about brakes in the future... better they search and find good info, than to start another thread.

  10. #790
    Gold Member gumus89's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PJF_Lude View Post
    yes i daily drive on semi's
    and you original point was, standard brakes can lock wheels

    At a speed less than 60kph, i was unable to lock my brakes. Pedal was pushed all the way to the floor. There was so much pressure in the braking system that i blew a seal in my proportioning valve. Regardless of whether i could stop quicker than a commodore, i was unable to brake to the limit of my daily driven tires.

    So therefore

    is an invalid arguement
    Just for arguements sake...

    You do have 20mm smaller rotors than the 4th and 5th gen VTiRs. This would presumably have a greater effect than the 8mm increase of the Brembos. Is this a correct assumption?
    <a href=http://www.preludeaustralia.com/forum/showthread.php?t=42730 target=_blank>http://www.preludeaustralia.com/foru...ad.php?t=42730</a>
    Back to it's former glory... Almost.

  11. #791
    PA Janitor Bob's Avatar
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    huh?

    Larger diameter rotors give more braking leverage. I.e. bigger rotors = increased stopping capacity.

    And. 300 - 282 = 18 last time I checked.

  12. #792
    QLD Administrator AdReNaLiN's Avatar
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    Bob is correct in saying the bigger the rotor the more leverage the caliper has to stop the rotor. It of course gives stopping capacity of the wheels themselves (not the car). Some get confused by this. Obviously the stickier (more grip) the tyre, the faster the car will stop.


    Just to throw another measurement into the mix...

    Car: dia x thickness
    3rd gen: 262 x 21
    4th gen (vti): 282 x 23
    S2k/brembo: 300 x 25


    The thickness of the rotor adds to its ability to "heat sink" and will therefore will not allow it to get as hot as quickly.

    I would go out on a limb here and say that the thicker rotor allows for a bigger area of "cooling vane" inside the rotor, also allowing for better cooling.

    These things matter mainly for track, but are worthwhile knowing too.

  13. #793
    Gold Member gumus89's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bob View Post
    huh?

    Larger diameter rotors give more braking leverage. I.e. bigger rotors = increased stopping capacity.

    And. 300 - 282 = 18 last time I checked.
    Lol, I misread. I must have turned my brain off.

    So yeah, I understand that the bigger the better, the main thing I was comparing were the VTiR brakes compared to the 3rd gens. The 20mm would be a big difference right? All im asking is how sticky does a tyre have to be for a vtir brake to not be able to lock them.
    Of course there are the other factors that have been mentioned, but on the street its mainly emergency stopping power.
    <a href=http://www.preludeaustralia.com/forum/showthread.php?t=42730 target=_blank>http://www.preludeaustralia.com/foru...ad.php?t=42730</a>
    Back to it's former glory... Almost.

  14. #794
    PA Janitor Bob's Avatar
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    Getting off track from Steves thread now.

    But comparing the stock 3rd gen brakes to Vtir brakes on a 3g. Increased rotor size of 20mm and caliper size. It is easier to lock up the brakes with less effort on standard street tyres. The big bonus for me was the fade resistance after multiple stops.
    The stock 3g brakes just kind of give up after a while..It takes a lot more effort to do the same thing to the Vtir brakes.

    The same would apply for steve in going from Vtir setup to the new brembo / 300mm rotor.

    He will of course need to turn up the wick on the turbo to get the car going due to the additional rotational mass. Can't hurt to have a few more ponies now can it.

  15. #795
    Senior Member Scotty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AdReNaLiN View Post
    Seriously though - the goal is to have it on the road before the end of this year.
    I'm liking the sound of this!

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